I don’t even want to replace my battery.
I want it to last. At least 5 years.
Bring legislation that enforces a 5 year warranty on batteries that are built-in. That would help the environment much more than being able to replace a battery every year that shouldn’t fail in the first place.
And yes, it’s possible to build batteries that last longer. It’s more effort, true. But so is building exchangeable batteries or doing an exchange.
I rather shell off 50 € more for my phone when I know that the battery will make it 5 years.
That is something that would be very hard to legislate. Especially since battery lifetime is dependent on a variety of external factors (charging-style, temperature of the device, luck). Build quality certainly also factors in, but even the best battery won’t survive a 10 year old regularly overheating their phones with games and charges it for the entire night. I would love to see OEMs implement nice things like “capacity settings”, where you can set your device to stop charging at 80% and show it as 100%.
This is exactly what happens in cars.
Usually, you have an 8 year warranty for your battery.
Yes, a phone is smaller. Less space and weight. But 5 years are less as well.
The electronics can track everything, shut the phone down if it’s too hot (and not when it’s so hot that it’s in danger to burst into flames like it is now).
Adjust the charging speed by temperature.
Do not charge the battery to 100 %.
…
These are all things that most phones already do, though. I think a realistic expectation of battery lifetime is needed here. Better allow for easier replacement in my opinion, the batteries themselves are not expensive (though we don’t want to generate unnecessary waste, so, of course we try to make them last as long as feasible)
The switch off far too late.
The battery is built for weight and size, not for durability.
The do not keep a margin to preserve battery life and charge way too high and too low.
Replacing batteries is the wrong approach, because it wastes resources we don’t need to waste.
I’m firmly convinced that 5 years battery life is achievable, if we just force the companies to do it.
It’s just cheaper for them not to do it right now. And companies always do what is cheapest.
And worse: This legislation will actually cement the battery degradation, because the companies have even less reason to build batteries that last. “Just replace them!” will be the answer if it’s dead after 6 months.
Do you have a citation on that 5 years being achievable now (or soonish)? I am not very knowledgeable on the state of battery manufacture and from my thinking the constraints we have to work with in phones are mostly volume. In a car you can just “add more battery” as a buffer, but in a phone that space just isnt there.
TL;DR: is there research on this kind of battery lifetime without major limits when it comes to capacity?
On a Phone, people are already conditioned to have their phone work all the time, no matter what you do to it, and there is an advertised Maximum Battery Capacity.
People don’t do the 80/20 rule on Phones because that’s outrageous to them.
But EV Manufacturers have built in the 80/20 rule into their cars. When you do long distance EV trips, the Route Planner will automatically tell you where the next charger that you will arrive at 20%-ish battery capacity will be and route you there. And the car will stop charging itself at 80% and you’ll be ready to go.
Phones on the other hand, tell you “Hey moron, I’m at 30% you should charge me!” And most phones don’t have a Battery Protection setting to cut charging at 80% (Samsung added this about a year ago to their phones)
If you shouldn’t charge over 80%, why don’t manufacturers just report a battery at 80% its “real” capacity as 100% charged? Same for the lower margins. It would probably make things easier for people to understand.
They would probably have to switch to LiFePO4 batteries to get 5 years reliably. That would increase the thickness of the phone quiet a bit if you want the same capacity.
Lipo batteries are not capable of being cycled daily for 5 years, even under ideal conditions.
Android (or at least some) have this feature now, the charging rate is usually adjusted based on time of the day, next alarm clock setting, charger type, etc
It would be nice to have it covered in a phone warranty or something. Would like to also see legislation requiring software updates for 5 years, is kind of silly how fast devices are considered obsolete by their manufacturers. Even Microsoft supports Windows versions for like 10 years.
I don’t even want to replace my battery. I want it to last. At least 5 years.
Bring legislation that enforces a 5 year warranty on batteries that are built-in. That would help the environment much more than being able to replace a battery every year that shouldn’t fail in the first place. And yes, it’s possible to build batteries that last longer. It’s more effort, true. But so is building exchangeable batteries or doing an exchange. I rather shell off 50 € more for my phone when I know that the battery will make it 5 years.
That is something that would be very hard to legislate. Especially since battery lifetime is dependent on a variety of external factors (charging-style, temperature of the device, luck). Build quality certainly also factors in, but even the best battery won’t survive a 10 year old regularly overheating their phones with games and charges it for the entire night. I would love to see OEMs implement nice things like “capacity settings”, where you can set your device to stop charging at 80% and show it as 100%.
This is exactly what happens in cars. Usually, you have an 8 year warranty for your battery.
Yes, a phone is smaller. Less space and weight. But 5 years are less as well. The electronics can track everything, shut the phone down if it’s too hot (and not when it’s so hot that it’s in danger to burst into flames like it is now). Adjust the charging speed by temperature. Do not charge the battery to 100 %. …
All things the manufacturer can influence.
These are all things that most phones already do, though. I think a realistic expectation of battery lifetime is needed here. Better allow for easier replacement in my opinion, the batteries themselves are not expensive (though we don’t want to generate unnecessary waste, so, of course we try to make them last as long as feasible)
No, they don’t.
The switch off far too late. The battery is built for weight and size, not for durability. The do not keep a margin to preserve battery life and charge way too high and too low.
Replacing batteries is the wrong approach, because it wastes resources we don’t need to waste.
I’m firmly convinced that 5 years battery life is achievable, if we just force the companies to do it. It’s just cheaper for them not to do it right now. And companies always do what is cheapest.
And worse: This legislation will actually cement the battery degradation, because the companies have even less reason to build batteries that last. “Just replace them!” will be the answer if it’s dead after 6 months.
Do you have a citation on that 5 years being achievable now (or soonish)? I am not very knowledgeable on the state of battery manufacture and from my thinking the constraints we have to work with in phones are mostly volume. In a car you can just “add more battery” as a buffer, but in a phone that space just isnt there.
TL;DR: is there research on this kind of battery lifetime without major limits when it comes to capacity?
On a Phone, people are already conditioned to have their phone work all the time, no matter what you do to it, and there is an advertised Maximum Battery Capacity.
People don’t do the 80/20 rule on Phones because that’s outrageous to them.
But EV Manufacturers have built in the 80/20 rule into their cars. When you do long distance EV trips, the Route Planner will automatically tell you where the next charger that you will arrive at 20%-ish battery capacity will be and route you there. And the car will stop charging itself at 80% and you’ll be ready to go.
Phones on the other hand, tell you “Hey moron, I’m at 30% you should charge me!” And most phones don’t have a Battery Protection setting to cut charging at 80% (Samsung added this about a year ago to their phones)
If you shouldn’t charge over 80%, why don’t manufacturers just report a battery at 80% its “real” capacity as 100% charged? Same for the lower margins. It would probably make things easier for people to understand.
They would probably have to switch to LiFePO4 batteries to get 5 years reliably. That would increase the thickness of the phone quiet a bit if you want the same capacity.
Lipo batteries are not capable of being cycled daily for 5 years, even under ideal conditions.
Android (or at least some) have this feature now, the charging rate is usually adjusted based on time of the day, next alarm clock setting, charger type, etc
It’s not android, but Google as far as I am aware. At least my battery settings (latest graphene OS) are… limited to say the least
Fair point, it would be nice if it was upstreamed
It would be nice to have it covered in a phone warranty or something. Would like to also see legislation requiring software updates for 5 years, is kind of silly how fast devices are considered obsolete by their manufacturers. Even Microsoft supports Windows versions for like 10 years.